UPDATE: iBC introduces, “The Citi Bailout Wire.”
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I see 100 Million not Billion
Typo, on their behalf. Citi’s pisses 100 million in toilet paper expenses.
The Feds could buy more than $100 billion in the bad assets if the plans go through.
This will cause a tidal wave of short covering, if true.
FXP’d!
Fuck you. FXP is irrelevant.
it figures, the maggots always win.
POOF!
The Tennessee Titan’s magical season, and their “we’re-actually-a-Super-Bowl-contender” mystique, is gone!
Haven’t heard anything about that, any links for further reading?
As a holder of that fucking UYG, I hope this is enough.
One more retarded typo in that cnbc piece and Gasparino qualifies for honorary Australian citizenship.
Glad to see Charlie spending his lost weekend on the job.
Will be interesting to see how much C pops on the news.
The Fly, he wins again, yes?
feds gotta do it. Fly nails it. mets rename field “FedField”
citi article:
http://www.cnbc.com/id/27873985
Thanks Duane.
No wonder I didn’t see it, I never go to CNBC.
Too Big To Fail.
My Quonset Hut in Sumatra (geat surfing destination) was was too big to fail a few years back, until it did.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122747680752551447.html?mod=testMod
Citigroup Inc. is nearing agreement with U.S. government officials to create a structure that would house some of the financial giant’s risky assets, according to people familiar with the situation.
While the discussions remain fluid and might not result in an agreement, talks were progressing Sunday toward creation of what would essentially be a “bad bank.” That structure would help Citigroup cleanse its balance sheet of billions of dollars in potentially toxic assets, these people said.
The bad bank also might absorb assets from Citigroup’s off-balance-sheet entities, which hold $1.23 trillion. Some of those assets are tied to mortgages, and investors have worried such assets could cause heavy losses if they land on the company’s balance sheet. Citigroup also has about $2 trillion in loans, securities and other assets on its balance sheet as of Sept. 30.
Behind the push is a broad effort to shore up faith in the New York company, which saw its stock price tumble by 60% last week to a 16-year low.
Under the terms being discussed, Citigroup would agree to absorb losses on assets covered by the agreement up to a certain threshold. The federal government would cover losses beyond that level, people familiar with the matter said. One person said the new entity is expected to hold about $50 billion of assets.
A Citigroup spokeswoman declined to comment on the discussions.
It is unclear whether the U.S. government will take an equity stake in Citigroup in return for providing a financial backstop. Also uncertain is if Citigroup would get a government loan to finance the facility. The government took that approach with insurer American International Group Inc. in late September.
It wasn’t known Sunday afternoon if Citigroup will have to make changes to its executive ranks, board or elsewhere inside the company in return for getting government assistance.
After weekend discussions between Citigroup executives and officials at the Federal Reserve and Treasury Department, the parties are hoping to unveil an agreement Sunday evening, the people said.
As Citigroup shares fell last week, Chief Executive Vikram Pandit and other top executives insisted that the plunge wasn’t a threat because the company has plenty of capital and liquidity. But by Friday, bank officials were hoping for a public expression of confidence by the government, believing that would help reassure clients and customers.
One rescue structure under consideration would resemble part of the $150 billion bailout plan that the government struck with AIG in November as part of a restructuring of the previous bailout. Two vehicles, funded largely by as much as $52.5 billion in government money, were created to take on risks from some of AIG’s souring assets, including exposure to credit derivatives.
That deal also reduced interest costs on AIG’s $60 billion loan from the government.
update.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/27873985
Are you sure that is Charlie G. in the CNBC article? The picture shows somebody who is clean shaven, smiling and sober.
If the Gov’t does not boost Citi’s stock price, that’s right, I said stock price, the market will collapse.
It’s their choice.
Either way, “The Fly” is still rich.
Why don’t these idiots just put out one press release with 100% facts in lieu of updates with partial facts/guesses?
Charlie Gasparino’s reporting is often fragmented due to him being on blow most of the time.
Because that would make “reporters” like the hard-hitting cnbc crowd obsolete.
I put in a low-ball bid for C on Friday, trying to be clever, but missed.
Managed to get some GOOG @ 248.50 for a trade. Missed AAPL by a dime. Bot UYG & XLF cheap, but set my stop too tight and totally lost out on the rally.
Typical.
Nighty night DD.
DEVILDOG is going to get raped by a bull the size of the Titanic tomorrow. Not only did I load up on TNA all day Friday, I didn’t sell it into the closing rally.
Here’s another article, just for good measure.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27877195/
CNBC
Reports from Washington say the White House is unaware of any government talks with Citigroup. It also declined comment on whether President Bush would back a government rescue of Citigroup.
Charlie G. interviewing his imaginary friends again?
I don’t understand how a David Blaine bailout does anything for the stock? It looks like another AIG to me. When the music plays you dance and sell.
My understanding is that at this “bad bank” instead of toasters and calenders it will be giving out cyanide to its new customers.
If a customer pulls up to this “bad banks” drive through window and the teller doesn’t like you the teller has the authority to send a heat seeking missile at your vehicle.
It’s a REAL BAD BANK.
Can’t be an AIG deal. It would have to be a UBS type deal, where the equity lives, else BAC, JPM and WFC fall down the same rabbit hole.
The BAD BANK will be similar to the BAD Lieutenant.
i love these chaotic markets. we’re going to miss them when they’re gone.
Kind of like GOOD cop BAD cop.
Sources with knowledge of the deal say government officials are now getting cold feet over the plan to buy the troubled assets from Citigroup.
Harvey Keitel would make a great bank regulator.
Or tax payer-installed HR chief.
For handling terminations.
I am with Fly on this one.
If they let C price collapse further they might as well close the markets as most major financial institutions (including insurers and investment brokers) will be toast.
The American financial system since the days of Alexander Hamilton will be poof.
The Feds blew it with LEH and C is a risk at least 10X as large. C does have may profitable divisions.
The FED should just get behind JPM, C, BAC and WFC in a very public way and let everyone know they will support them 100%, buying them some time until the economy stabilizes.
Once that is done I don’t see how any of these banks will be allowed to pay dividends if their common survives, at least until they pay the government back.
Interesting post, “Playing Chicken w/Citi.”
Scroll down to Nov 20:
http://www.informationarbitrage.com/index.html
Ive been short BAC from almost $18 (1500 shares).
JPM from $25 (1000 shares)
WFC from $27 (1000 shares)
Im going to cover 2 out of the three on Monday depending on the market.
If you were going to try to ride one of them into the ground, which stock would you stick with? If we bounce and it goes up a few points, Im not looking to cover. Its going to be a position that hopefully will have to get bailed out by the Gov.
WFC? BAC? JPM?
a friend is an accountant at C .. she says morale sucks, its the pits there …she’s thinking of leaving … her 401k is now ‘for shit’
same old shitbox everywhere in banking … another friends hubby works for BKUNA … he owned 100k shares when it was over 30 … now its 36 cents …never sold . there goes retirement & the kids education
lord almighty: $3,000,000+ down to $3,600
I have a friends getting laid off every week in NYC.
Weekly tits and ass…nothing wrong with a little tits and ass, weekly.
“The situation is fluid.”
As in parties on all sides are pissing their pants:
“You have HOW MUCH much in off balance sheet crap?”
“You’ll only give us THAT much for our prefs??”
Doom.
Everywhere.
Names in the Tontine Book that have been crushed. Many of these are still interesting stocks that have been blown apart. I’m listing mostly small caps
FIX
MTRX
XIDE
WLB
ITRN
AZZ
ITRN
BMI
LXU
TTEK
TNB
fortunately left many in late august. I’m starting to revist slowly….
Juice,
I’ve got friends at JPM that moved their entire 401k’s into JPM stock last month… ouch.
Morale their was great at that time and everyone was saying how they were the new “boss of banking”.
Morale not so good this weekend. I really feel horrible for them.
Nice. Looking forward to buying stock again. Perhaps the bottom will last a few more weeks now.
-DT
If there IS a C deal tonight, does C go up or down tomorrow?
If there is NO C deal tonight, does C go up or down tomorrow?
Who wants to bet the financials end down tomorrow? I mean why not, UYG just drops 20% every fucking day. Just fucking infuriating, I am in at $5.50 on it and just fucking taking a shitbath. Hell I have only owned the thing for 2 days. I am sure someone will tell me that financials are due for a selloff soon though. Fucking queers.
Watched Quantum of Solace this weekend. I didn’t realize Tim Seymour had quit his hedge fund to become an actor. Nonetheless, Tim did a pretty good job as the main villain Dominic Greene.
Check that link again. Charlie “Whatcha Got?” Gasparino just updated the link saying the government is getting cold feet.
It seems to me that the idiots in Washington are more likely to not do a deal, let Citi and the market crash, then say “oh wow we didn’t know” (and they wont be lying) and then try and do the deal later in the week when it is too late.
I got mad calls on Citi at $5 and I need my government bailout in the form of a jump to $10/share, baby!
I should have used DailyTA. Weekly is way too long.
Who is “the govt.” these days?
lol @ gapping. sorry for your pain, but that was pretty funny.
It’s morning in America… Yeeeeeaaaaa..
We ought to tag team more often, Fly.
Exactly fly, if the feds don’t boost the stock price we’re all fucked. I know this , you know this, let’s hope the Feds understand this.
It’s very important that j and the fly make money on this deal or we’re all fucked.
Don’t worry about a thing fly, the feds are working very hard to make sure we make money.
Anton.
Next time show a little courage of your convictions.
Hey fly:
You think we could ask the govt push up the value of other stocks in our portfolio seeing they’re working for us now?
Anton says:
One more retarded typo in that cnbc piece and Gasparino qualifies for honorary Australian citizenship.
That’s a really, really cheap shot Ants. A shot below the belt. I’m not going to counter that as it’s simply beneath me.
Like $100B is really enough…
That a boy J!
YOUR ATTENTION PLEASE! YOUR ATTENTION PLEASE! We Interrupt This Egregious Hand Wringing Session for A “Special Announcement:”
The New York Football Giants (10-1) are once again the indisputably best team in the NFL.
And the Titans are a sham.
That is all. Please return to your regularly scheduled flop sweating and leg pissing. Thank you.
_______
“I’m not going to counter that as it’s simply beneath me.”
Congratulations. You finally said something funny.
Hey Fly,
How about them “Titans”?
Anton
Let me let you in on a little secret. I can’t stand Aussie’s either as a generalized rule as they’re green socialist trogs for the most part.
jake, you’re not kidding. the giants have been making shit happen.
Just checking to see how thoroughly you read this blog, j.
You should make an extra effort to note and record all of my posts, in particular, for the purpose of self improvement. Will save you an Aussie fortune on Tony Robbins videos.
The self-loathing evident in your posts makes the bit about hating Aussies redundant, however.
The ones I’ve known have been okay.
Interesting post re: leverage, loans that won’t sell, Buffet & GS:
http://www.frontlinethoughts.com/pdf/mwo112108.pdf
I don’t loathe myself, Ants. I fucking me.
————————
What’s really interesting about Buffet is that he’s always talked about derivs saying they’re WMD and he could end up being fucked by going short options.
Man, what an idiotic bet. How anyone could bet the ranch on a short option strategy of any size let alone that size is beyond me.
Sounds like a bull trap, sell after the rally. Citi “pisses 100 [billion] in toilet paper expenses.”
“I fucking me.”
Indeed…
Go on.
Buffet’s volatility numbers don’t seem to add up:
http://www.portfolio.com/views/blogs/market-movers/2008/11/21/berkshire-hathaways-peculiar-volatility-numbers
Article insinuates he’s under reporting losses.
Anyone know what symbol will get you short the 30 yr bond? Double inverse or just regular would be appreciated?
Thanks
I see red to the East…
Good article TPup. I had read both 10Qs referenced there, but was not able to determine what the issue was. Now I understand.
Looks like instead of a turkey, we get a turkey burger for Thankgiving.
Between Citibank and Obama-Bahama-Mamma info, shouldn’t the futures been rocketing?
What is Gasbag reporting?
Hang Seng down about 2%
My name is AssNapkin and I dispense financial advice on the Internet.
Maria Caruso has huge titties…but she should shut the fuck up already
That fucking Indian has got to go, get him the fuck out of there! If he stays C is fucked!
In other news, Karen Tso is looking exceptionally alluring tonight.
You are racicist. All the trouble in this world is because of you devils born in himan disguise
You are racist. All the trouble in this world is because of you devils born in human disguise
sorry guys this message was meant for VaginalNapkin
they need to move Karen Tso to the US network and give Asia Maria Bartiromo in exchange…
I’m no racist. I hate everyone equally!
“Freud Says:
“I fucking me.”
Indeed…
Go on.”
HA! LMAO
Good one, Sigmund.
Three hours ago Gasparino said an announcement would be out by now. No new updates. Charlie may be an assclown, but I don’t doubt that he has people on the phone giving him info (or else his cousin will break their fucking legs).
They had better get this Citi deal done tonight or else the market is Timothy Treadwell (google it)
Damn Japs are slackers. Let’s see, twenty-seven days off, trade from 9-11 drink sake, then 1:30-3:00, take extra day off for holiday we don’t even celebrate, on the wrong frigging day to boot. Puke.
Small Fry:
lol
You better get on the horn to senator shelby fly, he’s not on board.
You buy now or you leave!!
Stock futures no reflect Citi news inflimation…
Wood you like the flied lice with that?
Here is fortune cookie for yooo, Mister Fly, you read!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65Vkqcrfh9A
j is a vegemite napkin.
Sources close to the deal tell me CROX will purchase C for an undisclosed sum of stale garlic bread and 3 day old pasta va zool.
oops
was in a hurry and made a typo/gram error. Feast on that fellas as you don’t get too me opportunities.
Especially you anton.
The pirates are negotiating a ransom for C:
http://tinyurl.com/69rsd8
“was in a hurry and made a typo/gram error”
MmmHmmm…
Go on.
“don’t get too me opportunities”
Flagrant Foul Issued to the one they call j.
Re C bailout:
http://www.informationarbitrage.com/2008/11/we-the-people-good-bank-bad-bank-our-bank.html
j, I love it when you fuck up ,which happens frequently. Keep fucking yourself.
Canuck
Keep focusing on the typos and gram. I’m sure you have to run it through Word seeing you’re (“closely”) genetically related.
Now tell us Cansie, which one is you?
http://www.demopolislive.com/members/dave/inbred.jpg
I reckon you’re the Brad Pitt lookalike on the right. LOL.
Grammer police – You forgot to mention. J wrote “anton”. Should be capitalized.
J – I don’t want to hear about you fucking yourself. I read this for trading ideas. You and CAP should exchange your ideas/techniques on another blog.
It’s “grammar.” Thank you.
Any buyers of UYG here?
Anon
Let me correct your own appalling 3 grade grammar.
Grammer police – You forgot to mention. J wrote “anton”. Should be capitalized.
Grammar Police;
You forgot to mention that J should have capitalized ” Anton”.
J – I don’t want to hear about you fucking yourself. I read this for trading ideas. You and CAP should exchange your ideas/techniques on another blog.
How about you making a start, anon. How about not being a pedant little prick, stop worrying about needless gram/typo errors and give us some of your trading ideas, you useless sponge.
this just in:
“gov’t to inject 20 billion seamen into C’s loading dock.”
“grammer” LOL
it’s “grmmmmer”
No, no it’s “grammmmer”. hahahahha
Nothing like a pompous twerp getting it wrong.
My father in-law dragged me to some investment seminar down in Newport Beach on Saturday. I listened to some schmuck from Wall Street talk for an hour about the efficiencies of the stock market, and anyone that outperforms his tilted index is “Lucky”. He went on and on, talking about the average Joe not being able to spot anomalies in time, due to the good ol’ boy network on Wall Street. As he was saying this, I was thinking … “Fuck You, Mr. Market is wrong a lot of the time, and my portfolio is up 96% this year”.
The most amazing part of this stupid seminar was the break session … that’s when my father in-law introduced me to “Jack”. Jack is about 75 years old, and seemed like a fairly intelligent fella … that is until the conversation of Lehman came up. You see, Jack lost $700,000 in that fucking piece of shit LEH. When he told me this, my bottom jaw dropped, and I looked at him (trying to hold my composure) … “Jack, I’m very sorry to hear that”.
All this is further proof that there are a of lot wealthy idiots out there. These idiots need management of their money. They are incapable of making wise investment choices.
This is bloody grimm.
Welcome back Anton.
Donny, thanks for sharing that. I hear about stuff like that way more often than like from wealthy bozos I know. Someday, I will steward their money for the benefit of all involved.
Europe looks bloody, I guess they don’t know about the big bad bank bailout hanky and the boyz are planning. BREEHEEHEE!!
those investment ‘seminar’ goons are morons. there are more of them around, however, than i’d ever thought imaginable. my old firm has annual seminars for their institutional clients, and the ignorance that floats through the conference rooms is always palpable, to say the least.
J,
It just occurred to me: are you the retarded Bee Gee?
TIA
Scum – you’re looking at Friday closing prices son. Europe doesn’t open for a couple more hours.
You see, Jack lost $700,000 in that fucking piece of shit LEH.
See Donny, $700,000 is relative. What if Jack has a networth of $100 mil +. $700k is less than a 1% hit. On the other hand if Jack is worth $10 mil, $700k is a 7% hit. Its all relative. $700k is nothing to someone worth $50mil, $100 mil or more. If you lost $7k and had a networth of $100k and JACK lost $700k and had a networth of $100mil, you lost more than Jack. Wealthy people think in relative, not absolute terms. Forget about thinking in terms of $$$. No wealthy person I know thinks in terms of actual $$.
FDIC to back $306 Billion in mortgage securities.
“White House says unaware of any Citigroup rescue talks”
http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idUSTRE4AM2C520081123?feedType=RSS&feedName=businessNews
I guess the White House isn’t even important enough to be kept in the loop.
^ of Shitigroup
DOW 30,000!!!!
C deal now being outlined on CNBC special report. Also details of the plan are up on WSJ site. Stock futures are now higher across the board.
Now a special message from Fly and the Family Stone:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnO35in-Hr4
The White House is unaware that a world exists outside of the White House.
Anyone else watch the Sunday morning political lineup of news shows? Every friggin Democrat AND Republican stopped just short of saying that George the Moron should simply tuck tail and run back to Texas NOW, and allow Obama to step to the plate. It’s a universal feeling in Washington and on Wall Street. Obama has the message. He’s coming up to bat this week and he’ll will hit it out of the park. American consumers will regain confidence and buy so much shit on Black Friday that the shelves will be bare.
I’m with Fly. DOW 30,000 in sight.
Via PPT, Stocks trading at or near cash:
1 ACTS 1.03821
2 ASH 1.19401
3 CHRD 0.990158
4 CISG 0.910617
5 CNTF 2.27638
6 COGO 1.28405
7 GRA 1.16339
8 GSIG 4.43433
9 GU 1.25093
10 HTZ 1.42592
11 ISSI 1.00849
12 KHD 1.95478
13 KONG 1.08045
14 MAXY 0.965912
15 MLNK 1.00826
16 NTE 1.19764
17 NWY 1.2004
18 OPXT 2.10404
19 PCR 0.933824
20 QXM 2.12365
21 REDF 1.05732
22 SIMO 0.999354
23 SOAP 3.15991
24 SPRD 1.85197
25 SSRX 0.973827
26 TKTM 2.15611
27 TUNE 0.930717
28 XING 5.85641
29 ZINC 0.902561
Most of them are shit sinkers. However, if you screen for stocks trading half their cash value, some decent names appear.
yes, this will give us a bounce, but, like every other bailout before this, it will all come crashing down in a few days.
up 200 tomorrow, down 600 wednesday or something like that.
gov’t to guarantee $300 Billion in Citigroup Assets:
http://www.cnbc.com/id/27881439
What’s your game plan for tomorrow Fly?
You think gap will be faded or does this have legs. I’ve been so shell-shocked by this market I have no confidence in my own predictions anymore.
Basically the question is whether you’re selling into this or riding the wave?
The best bull moves are built off the accounts of the non-believers. So many are now conditioned to failures of a bounce to hold, they short into the bounce. The bounce keeps going, they keep shorting. The bounce keeps going, and going, and going. We’re there now. You can’t spit without hitting a couple hundred non-believers within a 2 foot radius.