Please do not Feed!
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It’s been that kind of week-end, where rules, and their breaking seem to be dominating the conversation. So I’m going to take this opportunity to break the rules and “feed the troll” as is so many times advised against. I am hoping the attention I’m feeding this poor guy will serve as ameliorative to our overall discussions, rather than just a sop to his ego problems.
First let’s define “a typical internet blog troll.” We are not just talking about someone who brings a disagreement, for we have many honorable members of that tribe on my more partisan site. I would point out Bruce “Juicyfruit” as one good example and former Employee 8, now “Teahouse on the Tracks” as another. These are gentlemen who can carry on sometimes heated discussions without resorting to cheap ad hominum, or personal attacks on their opponents. I don’t think it coincidental that both are members of The PPT, either, as it is a repository of outstanding gentlemen.
Not so the case with the ad hominem Trolls that we’ve accumulated under our iBC.com bridge. As an example, note this screed I received on my last post regarding the threat of Obamacare. For your benefit, I’ve bolded all the extraneous ad hominem nastiness that can be disregareded by anyone seeking logical argument. I’ll have to admit, it pares the piece down quite a bit:
Jake,
Just one word – why? What was your point with this post? It is just one long partisan fluff piece that still does not answer the question “who are you, what do you believe in, and how do we get there”. It’s the same-ol-sht with you pal, attack, attack, attack – using fear mongering and a weak nexus that falls of its own weight. Let’s begin with the fear mongering:
– “…we’re cooked for a long time.”
– “…inevitable government rationing takes hold.”
– “…destroys a vital part of our economy in the process.”
– “Say goodbye to solid, high quality healthcare you’ve enjoyed…”The last point is a hoot. The last time the WHO ranked the world systems, we (the USA in case you doubt where I am from) came in 37th behind Finland, Costa Rica, Saudi Arabia, etc. Your standards are pretty low my man. This statement is symptomatic of the virus that flows through your veins – make shit up, ignorant followers will believe it.
The paragraph on rationing is akin to listening to Greenspan spew on about his market philosophy. Let’s not forget the following http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oLHfKjiQew . This paragraph on your market philosophy is pure filler in an attempt to use college level transitions in your writing.
(That’s right folks, not one whit of logical reply or argument yet. Pure “attack the person.” Demonstrative, no? –ed.)
The very next paragraph cites an article from The Medicus Firm, which is a national physician search firm (A NATIONAL PHYSICIAN SEARCH FIRM!), is frequently cited by right wingers to support their healthcare position especially when it comes to the claim that doctors will flee our system once the bill is passed. Bill O’Reilly is one such Medicus Fan. This same argument is being used by the right when it comes to “too big to fail”. Jake – you really need to stop watching Fox. Read a book or two – mix it up a bit. Remember, the healthcare industry has paid over 200 million to lobby against the bill. Don’t get suckered into their propaganda. BTW, the survey that the Medicus Firm conducted has already been found to be unscientific. Dude, look behind the curtain every now and then.
The price fixing follow-up paragraph to the Medicus smoke-n-mirrors is another weak attempt to draw market talk/conditions/beliefs into the health care discussion so that you don’t appear to be totally political with your post (or so that you can show creative paragraph transitions – I haven’t figured it out yet). The nexus is weak and you put no meat on the bones. Just relying on the feeble minded to take your leap of logic and say “’ummmm…yeah, that’s right.”
(LOL. Certainly makes the response easier doesn’t it? One wonders if the troll even realizes he’s making it difficult to ascertain whether he’s really even got an argument yet? There’s no mention of support for socialized medicine, yet, fwiw. — ed.)
You then move back to political attacks with your falling rock metaphor that just crashes to earth. If a rock falls in the forest and no one is there, does it make a sound? You seem puzzled by the notion that we just don’t understand that an unfettered free market is the way to go. Please – spare me with this free-market crap. In case you forgot already – see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oLHfKjiQew .
The remainder of your article deals with patronizing “hope” – the audacity! However, it could only possibly be understood by “…those of you (that) understand rational market systems…” That is, for those of us that don’t drink from Jake’s cup-o-cool aid, then, well you are just not understanding, advocates of rational, free market systems. Lol – what a hoot.
(That’s right, save for that little unbolded bit above, we’re still doing about .050 out of 1.000 on the “repliable argument” scale. Don’t act surprised, this is actually a decent ratio for most internet trolls. — ed.)
The post was a fair attempt at composing an argument with college level structure that would have gotten you a B- in English; however, I am certain your poly sci professor would have given you a C- due to lack of non-partisan supporting facts, lack of argumentative depth, and lack of a coherent nexus throughout the write up. However, with that said, I am certain there are many out there that just say “agreud!”.
And that’s pretty much all there is folks. Amazing, no?
First, I’d like to thank Alvari, whom I’ve affectionately dubbed “Lungsac” due to an early misreading of his name, for giving me such a great example of exactly what’s behind most trollish arguments — ironically, ” a lot of expelled hot air.”
As a sop, and a “thank you,” I will now address the very few addressable arguments he provided in contradiction…
First, his argument that medical personel will not exit the industry upon imposition of price capitation. Note, he doesn’t really have an argument against that statement, only a weak attack on the polling source I provided:
The very next paragraph cites an article from The Medicus Firm, which is a national physician search firm (A NATIONAL PHYSICIAN SEARCH FIRM!), is frequently cited by right wingers to support their healthcare position especially when it comes to the claim that doctors will flee our system once the bill is passed.
Note, it’s hard for him to even get a partially data-based statement out without referring reflexively to presumably evil “right wingers,” or worse, the Left’s most hated bogeyman, “Fox News.”
I have no knowledge of this being “used by right wingers,” for the record. I simply took the first article on the subject I found on Google. The internet is replete with examples of doctor’s being at their breaking point. I guess Google is become an arm of the nefarious Murdoch Empire, I don’t know.
That’s probably why he couldn’t supply anything that says doctors will be seeking to pick up more Medicare patients and other government payors as a result of this wonderful legislation. Meanwhile, I can find many more articles on the displeasure of the provider community. No doubt, it’s all a “right wing conspiracy” brought to you by Fox News!
Second, let’s take the World Health Organization (“WHO”) left wing talking point put forth by M. Le Troll, which claims the US is the “37th ranked healthcare service in the world.” First, a reasonable person might ask, “What is the WHO?” Not many will be surprised to find this fraying crutch of the left is the largely anti-American United Nations’ health advocacy group with a strong predisposition to socialized medicine “for all my friends.”
“Quelle suprise,” no? Now, is anyone surprised to find that the WHO’s criteria for a decent health care system mandates a socialized medicine diktat? I quote CATO’s evisceration of this leftist fallacy:
So what of the United States placing 37th – behind Slovenia – in the WHO rankings? WHO rankings result from an index of five health-related statistics: health level, health distribution, responsiveness, responsiveness distribution and financial fairness. Only health level and responsiveness, Whitman writes, are justifiable measures of a health system. The remaining rankings, he argues, fail to take into account differences in health outcomes not explained by spending or literacy, and instead attribute them to health care performance, creating a fertile ground for demagoguery and selective citation.
“The WHO health care ranking system does not escape ideology,” concludes Whitman. “On the contrary, it advances ideological assumptions under the guise of objectivity. Those interested in objective measures of health system performance should look elsewhere.”
In closing, I welcome sensible argument, even from the hard left. But if all the trolls can bring is envious ad hominem, I have no interest in responding.
Be forewarned, proponents of government health care– your assumptions and your emotional arguments will be challenged at every juncture. Gird your loins for further demolition.
Best to you all, even the misguided Leninists.
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Update: Can you imagine Barack Obama had been delivering speeches like this as Congresscritter? Here’s a follow up… did he deliver any?
[youtube:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwk1aHU-pms 450 300]______________
Agreed, and hear hear!!!
Sorry if my posts sound a little self serving, but it was not by my hand that I landed into the position I am in now. Been trying to better my life and my familys life, but there are those who think they have all the answers at hand. Its tought to find work in the market place when all the illegals work for less than minimum wage and there are no jobs to be had. It takes money to make money or to start a business. Its a never ending struggle to make ends meet, and now the government wants me to pay my way to healthcare. Man, its tough not to go under with the bills ans taxes every year. So i apologize to my detractors for not being the superhero money makers that they have become, while I struggle to survive.
As for my blogging, its a free world, so stick it. This aint RUSSIA!!!
At least it’s not Russia YET, Rand.
Whether one is for or against Obama Care it seems to me that everybody should be able to agree that the quality of care will suffer in the future.
Some 45% of doctors polled say they will quit if (and when it passes).
Assuming “only” 10-15% will actually quit and some 30,000,000 uninsured are dumped into the system (and another 10-12 million illegals later cause you know it will happen) then where will the docs come from?
Check out Europe and you will see plenty from Pakistan, etc filling the void.
By the way my brother is a Doc in South Florida and some 80% of his patients are medicaid or medicare now and the fees are barely covering his overhead. He is preparing to close his doors over the next few years as ObamaCare will further reduce his payments.
Forgot to tell Rand to try and stay positive (I know it’s tough) and be flexible about seeking employment outside your field.
It seems to me that an employer would want to hire a former business owner.
Get a part time job if you can until things get better.
Hopefully, you are not over 50 years old- they are and will be getting screwed.
One net positive — Florida won’t be voting “blue” again for another 30 years, as the elderly are chucked under the bus — Soylent Green style.
I feel for your concerns, my friend.
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Rand – I haven’t been following your story, but I am sorry to hear you are struggling to find work. Rooting for you, ovah heah! Keep up the fight. You will land on your feet. Hang in there. MOOBS
Rand,
You’re not the only one in this situation. There are thousand upon thousands of us that are on the verge of losing everything. Odd that you align yourself with a blogger who would cut off your unemployment tomorrow because he thinks your too lazy to find a job. Or maybe you cant collect unemployment and that adds to your bitterness. I do not read your posts as self serving. More like self pity. I worked 3 jobs for two years getting through a previous recession. Whatever it took. I cut fucking grass at 38 yrs old to put food on the table. Whatever it took. This recession cost me my business and now being physically disabled I cannot work a job. I do not blame anyone else. Its called life. I just had to figure out another way to pay the bills. Thanks to the people at IBankCoin I am almost there. I came across IBC 15 months ago and thought this shit should be easy. Quickly learned that I would lose everything real quick. I have spent 8-12 hours a day 7 days a week for the last year studying, reading, researching, developing a trading plan, designing trading systems, learning everything i could about the markets, stocks, options, sector rotation, technical and fundamental analysis, charts, indicators, day, swing, scalp trading, trend and position trading, paper trading and slowly dipping into the market with real money. I will do whatever it takes to make this work. And if it doesnt, then I will man up and cash out and my family will be taken care of from the insurance. But they will be taken care of. Guaranteed. My point in all of this Rand is you have to find your motivation. The brain power from this site has been amazing from the bloggers to the P gallery. I found motivation from the super hero money makers of this site. Jake included. I love his financial blog. Cant stand his politics. But he can damn sure teach the ups and downs of precious metals and I just ignore the politics. Maybe one day I’ll write a thank you story in the Peanut Gallery but I still have much work to do to make this a sucess story. Whatever it takes. Do not be bitter about your loss Rand. Do not envy others their success. Find your motivation. Do whatever it takes.
Best of luck to you.
Thanks for the back handed compliment, as its better than a back hand!
However, I do take issue w your description of my “politics.”. The effects of extending unemployment bennies have nothing to do w “laziness” but rather simple economic incentives.
Gauging from your story, you are very familiar with the difference.
FWIW, we have had some similar experiences, mine sans the disability, however. Your story is inspiring.
You should share it on the Peeg for those dealing w similar issues.
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Jake,
It was not meant as a back hand. The unemployment remark was based on a comment you made a few days ago (see below) not your politics. The compliment was heartfelt. I do appreciate your market contributions and I have learned much from your blog. Instead of saying I cant stand your politics I should have said I cant stand reading politics I really dont care about others political views. No one will change sides based on internet discussions. I am far left, center left, center right or far right depending on the selected topic. I have no idea how this health care reform will work out, I take whats given and figure out how to get the most from it.
Continued success.
JakeGint says:
March 20, 2010 at 1:18 pm
Sure thing. Nothing makes a guy want to get his ass off the couch like extended unemployment bennies.
Pass me another beer, would you?
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I am not worried about HC reform for myself, but for the fabric of the country. There is a reason socialist countries rot from within, and it stems from an abdication of responsibility.
I may have been harsh in my assessment of the effects of extended unemployment, but institutionalization is real, and it saps social cohesion and responsibility.
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It should be obvious by now to every thinking human being that the “rot” here in the USA has already started.
That’s the point Rand …. when one is facing such a hardship, must one sell the house in a terrible market or file bankruptcy cause their son’s appendix erupted or their wife just found out she has brain cancer? Nobody should be in a position to lose it all when tragedy strikes at the worse possible moment – unemployed and without health insurance! Reminiscent of the dust bowl and bankers foreclosing on farmers property in the midst of a depression … that’s the free market, take the poor guys property but bale out the rich bankers when it’s they who are on the wrong side of a depression …. nice!
No, that wouldn’t be “the free market” that would be corporate fascism, which is what we are dealing with today with our three trillion dollar budget, and our “protected” Fortune 1000.
One of the first tenets of the GOP health plan was to sever the relationship between employment and health insurance by establishing tax free portability (to make their status equal to the tax free bennies distributed by employers who can afford that sort of thing).
The Dems, strong proponents of the current corporate fascist regime, refused.
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Closing on 45, and yea you would think that they would take a former business owner and someone in the mechanical field. But i think they figure that i have too much experience, ah well..
Become a once again business owner, maybe?
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Moobs,
Thank you. Well wishes welcome.
Jake,
Wish i had the money that i did 10 years ago, i might have been able to start another business. I had a paint and body business, a franchise. A franchisor who sold another business too close to mine and pushed me out of the market. Cost me my livelihood and too much money trying to save it.
Some fellow wanted me to mow his lawn- sure thing-i live in houston texas. I charge for the mile driving. Still game?? Gracias
Rand,
I apologize for the blunt comments earlier. I understand your position and sympathize with you because I have been exactly where you are numerous times. We are not that far apart in age or location. I was initially trying to offer some constructive advice but threw in some sarcasm to and subtlety to make my point. I will share with you my story and maybe it will help you or someone else, maybe not. But it is free.
After I was laid off, I immediately found part time work as a bricklayer with a guy I knew who dropped out of high school. I did not ask him (I told him) that I would help him get more jobs as long as he could employ me for four hours per day 8-12. I kept my routine of working out first thing in the morning, dropped my kid off at school and went to work until noon. I did this for three months at $10 per hour. I lived on Ramen noodles and canned tuna (packed in oil, more calories). I slashed spending throughout the household and explained to my wife and son the importance of everyone kicking in to help with the bills.
I got more than my slice of humble pie, I got the whole pie.
During the day hauling rocks, I tried to focus on where the opportunities are and how I could cash in. I spent countless hours after work researching and networking to see who was still making money and where the money was in motion. Over time, I formulated a plan for the various opportunities at hand and started down a path to finalize what made the most sense. The ability to work from home without startup costs has never been better so when you say it takes money to make money, I’ll politely disagree. When I finally decided on what I wanted to capitalize on, I committed my life to it. I spent little time wtih my family for four months working incredible hours but finally hit around Sept. and never looked back. Yes, it almost killed me but I endured and will cherish the moment when I cash out. Granted, what I do is not my passion (I love trading) but it is my livelyhood and it is more important than my passion ever will be.
I truly hope you find your place. I have a lot of friends in Houston in various capacities and many of them have their challenges but they will all be winners because they are creative and ingenious.
As a sidenote, my musical motivation every morning was No Excuses (Unplugged), Alice in Chains. It was so ironic.
Excellent story, thanks.
FWIW, I think many of us have been in your shoes. Your story, however, is an inspiration.
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@Rand — You seem like a bright guy. You will work it out, I have no worries.
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Touche’ pussygato!!
For the fans of government-managed medicine, something to look forward to…
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I’d much rather see universal health care than welfare payments. There’s not much that you can do about a lot of shit that happens to you health-wise (like my appendix exploding a year ago), and it sure is a nice feeling knowing I will be taken care of. Creating welfare was one of the biggest mistakes in Western history.
You may be misunderstandin, but universal health (ie, “socialized medicine”) is state welfare, doled out via an overburdened service sector.
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Gordo, i understand, and thanks. My pantry looks like that, plus cat foot for my four legged dependant. I asked my accountant if i could claim him, lol, but its not all too bad. I did manage to wrangle a little cash from uncle sam, it will pay a few late bills. Trying to talk a friend od mine to let me be a temp hauler for some products he needs in sulphur louisiana tomorrow. So maybe tomorrow will be a plus day.:) keeping it real as often as i can. And you have a great day at the bell, i will be watching as i drive to louisiana.
Biggest Troll= Larry Kutlow or whatever the losers name is. Talks everyone down and thinks he is so smart. He just pisses me off regardless if I agree or disagree with what he is arguing against.
Brilliant.
We’ve engendered a veritable Swiftian revolution this weekend, it seems.
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The most powerful argument against healthcare is FreddieMac and FannieMae. These were two entities controlled by the government and then look what happened. They are not the only examples, however. I could go on and on with how the US government seems to mismanage just about everything.
Do I think everyone should have healthcare? Yes. Do I think the United States government can manage healthcare effectively? No.
In years past, we have oftentimes heard the same old song out of government run programs. Cost over-runs, corruption, bribery, and obvious mismanagement. After seeing FNM and FRE collapse, I will never ever trust the government to run a system of any kind…
Actually the best arguments against gov’t healthcare (which is what I think you meant) are the current government healthcare vehicles — Medicare and Medicaid.
a.k.a. “Broke” and “Broker.”
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Jake,
You should really look up what “ad hominem” means.
Spooks. I posted a link above, dumbshit. Why not hit it?
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From the inimitable Canadian national treasure, Mark Steyn:
Happy Dependence Day! [Mark Steyn]
Well, it seems to be in the bag now. I try to be a sunny the-glass-is-one-sixteenth-full kinda guy, but it’s hard to overestimate the magnitude of what the Democrats have accomplished. Whatever is in the bill is an intermediate stage: As the graph posted earlier shows, the governmentalization of health care will accelerate, private insurers will no longer be free to be “insurers” in any meaningful sense of that term (ie, evaluators of risk), and once that’s clear we’ll be on the fast track to Obama’s desired destination of single payer as a fait accomplis.
If Barack Obama does nothing else in his term in office, this will make him one of the most consequential presidents in history. It’s a huge transformative event in Americans’ view of themselves and of the role of government. You can say, oh, well, the polls show most people opposed to it, but, if that mattered, the Dems wouldn’t be doing what they’re doing. Their bet is that it can’t be undone, and that over time, as I’ve been saying for years now, governmentalized health care not only changes the relationship of the citizen to the state but the very character of the people. As I wrote in NR recently, there’s plenty of evidence to support that from Britain, Canada and elsewhere.
More prosaically, it’s also unaffordable. That’s why one of the first things that middle-rank powers abandon once they go down this road is a global military capability. If you take the view that the US is an imperialist aggressor, congratulations: You can cease worrying. But, if you think that America has been the ultimate guarantor of the post-war global order, it’s less cheery. Five years from now, just as in Canada and Europe two generations ago, we’ll be getting used to announcements of defense cuts to prop up the unsustainable costs of big government at home. And, as the superpower retrenches, America’s enemies will be quick to scent opportunity.
Longer wait times, fewer doctors, more bureaucracy, massive IRS expansion, explosive debt, the end of the Pax Americana, and global Armageddon. Must try to look on the bright side…
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Yep, that pretty much sums it up. I’m getting drunk. Fuck, I may call in fucking sick tomorrow. The gov’t will take care of me anyway.
I think you and DMG should get a bottle of Woodford, a .45 and go out and strangle/shoot you some ornery emus.
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Yes, that sounds great! The wife and I are going to try out some pistols this week. Her only requirement? That they make it in pink. Can you imagine getting your balls blown off by a blonde wielding a pink pistol?
Hey, Lionel made pink trains for Daddy’s with baby girls … why not?
huh?
I think he means the toy trains. Surely you are familiar w. the brand “Lionel?”
No joke — my former screaming liberal wife said to me last night, “I think I’m going to go out and buy a gun, because I think this is the beginning of the end.”
From moony, care-free liberal to post-apocalyptic Mama, it only takes a couple of years of “livin’ w. Jake!”
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I suspect your father-in-law knows of this blog and his online personality
lives under a bridge. ; )
There’s a new show on teevee called ‘Justified’ (FX or Spike?) i watched last night that is taking place in Harlan County, KY.
We are big fans. I talked about it the other night.
I know that bridge on Tates Creek Road in Lexington, where the big baddie knocks of the junior nazi.
Told the FIL to watch it, since he was a big Deadwood fan. As you know the lead actor is the sheriff from that show.
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“And, as the superpower retrenches, America’s enemies will be quick to scent opportunity.”
It is laughable that your concern for our enemies scenting opportunity only arises now. Bin Laden’s stated hope was that we’d fight asymmetric wars in his back yard and bankrupt ourselves – – we obliged –you cheered.
Your hero, the idiot Bush, brought us from Gingrich’s surpluses to the biggest debt in history because of those wars and because of his buying the complacency of the voting public by not honestly funding and paying for those wars. Also, the huge increases in domestic spending under Bush (like the $trillion Part D giveaway), seem to have escaped the notice of rabid partisans like yourself.
Separately, to hear you rail against trolls and personal attacks betrays an astounding lake of self-awareness.
What would a post about obnoxious straw men argument throwing trolls be without our favorite Bush Derangement Syndrome Sufferer?
Sorry you felt neglected, Purdy. Hope this recognition will suffice to assuage your ego.
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First off, let’s make sure we know what internet trolls are. Here is a copy/paste of a more humorous definition that kinda packs a punch.
—Ha! Kudlow may be many things, perhaps a troll in real life (I don’t know), but I don’t think he is an internet troll. Jake (I think) is talking about internet trolls? No?
The Common Blog Troll
Scientific name: Blogus-trollus
Physical Characteristics: Since the common blog troll is a very elusive species and tends to emulate homo sapiens when confronted in Real Life (the habitat of homo sapiens) it has thus escaped proper description. It is said that its head is covered with green warts and its body largely resembles a cone.
Color: Yellow-green, orange, red, black, white, purple and variations there-of.
Habitat: The common blog troll can be found nosing around any web log that allows the posting of comments.
Belongs to the common troll group.
The Common Blog Troll is a recently discovered species, most likely evolved from the Common Usenet Troll or perhaps its close cousin, the Common Forum Troll. Its primary source of nourishment is a response to its excrement, which is left in the form of a comment on any web blog which allows comments. Its best not to feed the troll, otherwise it might make itself at home and litter said blog with ever growing piles of excrement. Once the pest moves into a web blog the best way to eradicate it is by the use of “IP Ban” which comes free with many forms of web blog.
It should be noted that even an IP ban is not entirely effective in removing the most persistent of trolls – as the more intelligent ones have the ability of using different IP addresses. In that case only vigilance, patience and time will get rid of the pest completely.
Can this be?
Welcome to Amerikaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcBaSP31Be8
I’ve always been partial to this view of an internet troll.
And I’ll admit that that kind of single minded intensity towards winning an argument has gripped my brain from time to time.
Jake, nice formatting.
Having returned from a business trip recently and still re-adjusting myself…I’ll keep my mouth shut and keep moving on.
That ‘toon is deservedly lionized.
Good to see you again.
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A bit-o-history for the uninitiated. The day was January 27, 2010 – the day that Oshamalamadingdong was entertaining us with his state-o-the-union. I just got done recommending USU, which BTW has risen 48% since the call. For anyone that cares, my facts can be checked on the Fly’s blog post “Milquetoast with Coffee” posted on Wednesday, January 27, 2010 at 3:10 pm. Prior to this date, I never personally went after Jake – in fact, I respected the person. Speak of “extraneous ad hominem nastiness”. You are a fraud and hypocrite my friend.
But it’s the Internet. Who gives a shit.
At least Jake isn’t Tiger “Fucking” Woods who’s kids will eventually be able to look up Daddy’s nasty text messages to his hooker G/F. How embarrassing?
I recall the good old days when an affair was secret. Even when uncovered, it was still secret. Now it’s a blog, website, t-shirts and transcripts.
Growing up pre-Facebook, etc ruled! You poor cheating bastards of today stand no chance.
You get the trophy for tonight with that Moniker. Kudos.
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@ Alvari — Too bad your entire post, as reflected above, contradicts your claim, Hippocrates.
Please, continue to be my “foil” — I prefer when they are knee-jerk and thin-skinned. 😉
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Sorry buddy – it’s my last post on your tab. You will need to provide your own traffic – as you always do. A full 45%. Cheers.
This is one of those days when I miss living in the old communist country when I could just have this JCunt ordered to disappear and never to be heard from again. What a piece of SHIIIIAAAAT! He is someone that I would enjoy torturing personally as opposed to have someone else do it for me. On the other hand, I love a democratic free country where the little guy gets his DAY, like today! Besides, I know this wiesel has a family, so I wouldn’t truly want to hurt him even though he really deserves a lesson.
Weeeell, I guess it IT IS AS IT IS. I can’t solve all the world’s problems… but the little woman who has two jobs and three kids can take her sick child to the doctor going forward. I got to say I am HAPPY with that. If this means the cocksucker insurance companies supported by cocksuckers like J—t don’t make as much money…so be it. I can live with that!
I know I said I wouldn’t ever visit your tab again, I lied. I guarantee you I will never visit this neo-fascist site, going forward, again. And the fact that Le Fly is banning politics in his domaine, means that this cocksucker, J—T, wont have much to say anyway!
Hey Joe, are you SeRiouS?
rofl
There is no way “Joe” could be “serious.”
My theory — it’s a regular pulling our leg, going over the top, so to speak.
Whomever you are, watch the “C” word, or you will be banned, former Staasi Guard credentials or no.
We have ladies on this forum.
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Good one Jake. It is not easy to argue with irrational people which I find most pro-Socialists to be. I have several friends who are doctors and they unanimously think this bill is a disaster for them. There is already an acute shortage of primary care physicians DUE to the pathetic reimbursement rates, the specialists are next. By the time this is over, doctor’s offices will resemble the cattle-call we call the DMV–take a number, sit down, and shutup.
I am already hearing it here, and this is not a “big money” doctor area.
Question for demand-sie only “progressives” — Why invest a couple of hundred thousand and 8-10 years of school to be told your service is “a right?”
Why would a smart person take that kind of shit in a free country?
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Why do we let our corporations export all are best paying jobs – stands to reason the professional service industry is next …. cosmetic surgery has already moved off shore, transplants will be next.
At least doctors and lawyers can still make a living down the street …. isn’t that enough incentive?
Not if we want to continue to lure the highest quality minds, no.
What would you do if someone asked you to work harder for a 35% discount in fees?
Sure, some of these guys will struggle on, due to the invested capital factor, but many will leave, and what’s worse, we won’t attract quality replacements.
You want someone like “Joe” the ex-Staasi secret police guard (see comment above) looking over your liver?
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Replacements – due to the inability of American families to afford to send their kids to college other than StateU …
I want the right to sell my body after death for $250k so my sons can pay off their student debt and afford a new home in the coming weimar republic …
Make sure you specify that it’s in silver or gold specie! 😉
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So the Dems passed their 2300-page suicide note. Splendid.
It’s a high probability that Obama will get tossed in 2012 and the GOP will take the boots to the health care reform. It’s an easy win to campaign off of (assuming they get their shit together).
Chin up, all is not lost
It’s a long way to 2012.
Elections have consequences. Perhaps we’ll be inoculated for another thirty-forty years….
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Pray the VAT gets introduced – that shit pisses people off more than any other.
I watched it kill the Conservatives for 20 fucking years.
Kinda like predictions of a stock market decline/crash upon Obama being elected when indeud we have had one of if not the greatest market rally of all time, no?
What happened, please explain …. LOL
he did what Bush did only to the 30th degree. At this rate Debt/GDP will eventually be 100% and by eventually I mean in 2 years.
Exactly what I said would happen.
“Dollar death.”
Or did you think they had some other way to pay for all this nonsense?
And the market did crash when Barack was elected… it just took a couple of weeks for it all to sink in…
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but you didn’t predict “dollar death” upon his election …. all here prepared for depression
As Fly said, prefer the re-inflation over depression as it’s better for my investment account … surely you are rejoicing his election now if for no other reason than you investment returns since … tongue in cheek!
From TN Senator Lamaar Alexander:
U.S. Senator Lamar Alexander (R-Tenn.), chairman of the Senate Republican Conference, today released the following statement regarding passage of the health care bill in the U.S. House of Representatives:
“This is an historic mistake. And unlike Social Security, Medicare and civil rights legislation, the only thing bipartisan about it is the opposition to it.
“The mistake is to expand a health care delivery system that is already too expensive instead of reducing its cost so more Americans can afford health insurance.
“This taxes job creators in the middle of a recession. It means Medicare cuts and premium increases for millions of Americans. When you include the cost of paying doctors who serve Medicare patients, it will increase the national debt.
“It will force governors to cut higher education funding, and raise taxes and tuition to pay for new Medicaid costs. In Tennessee, the governor says the cost will be $1.1 billion or more over five years.
“And the last-minute Washington takeover of the student loan program will add a half trillion more to the debt and overcharge 19 million student loans to help pay for health care.”
He’s right, the egregious “slip in” of the student loan market takeover is just one more sign of the abject thievery this Congress will stoop to.
Sorry, college kids. Elections have consequences.
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Maybe this will awake state and local governments that have let their self serving pension benefits run out of control to the point that the public sector employee is now not only at a par but paid a premium to some of the best paying private sector jobs. It’s time for them to start reigning in public sectors benefits in lieu of the usual tax & fees to pay for their sins. Gotta start somewhere … and pension deficits are mad scary.
I expect there are going to be a lot of p-ssed off ex-policman out there.
Good reason to get armed sooner rather than later….
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So I need a pink-o gun too ???
I wouldn’t call ex-policemen pinkos if I were you.
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I’m getting drunk. I really didn’t think this bill would pass. I trusted that the Dems were smart enough to know that this would mean for America.
In the words of the immortal Senator Blutarski:
You fucked up, you trusted us.
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16 out of 45 posts are posted by the one and only JC–t. I have one thing to say to you tonight: Democracy wins and fascism LOOSES, so fuck off and die you little mengele!
Shedder,
Don’t lay it on so “thick” (literally), or the real libs might start catching on.
Best,
Jake.
Jake, unfortunately, that wasn’t me.
The good news?
They are going to run out of money before most of the “reforms” are implemented.
The bad news?
The Repubs are going to be stuck raising taxes and cutting entitlements.
What does this mean?
America, meet Greece. Greece, America!
The Repubs will never raise taxes.
They will also never cut entitlements.
If anything, they will expand entitlements. See: “Medicare Prescription Drug Plan”.
(America is also unlike Greece, in that Greece doesn’t control the Euro printing press.)
Both parties are counting on being able to run up massive debt, secure in the knowledge that Ben Bernanke will monetize that debt.
Looks like he’s doing that as we speak!
Clack Clack Clack-a Clack!
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No cocksucker, that wasn’t anyone else but me. The one who sees right through your transparent shity existence. This is the last time I get on your blog. It is not nice to gloat but I couldn’t help it. Sue me cocksucker!
Joe -just to clarify things, the US of A is a REPUBLIC,it is not a DEMOCRACY…
http://www.stopthenorthamericanunion.com/NotDemocracy.html
you mean “was”… I find it ironic that joe calls this healthcare bill an “end of facism”….
Facism is state sponsored corpritism. only possible by making government bigger and businesses smaller so those in influence can decide what laws helps who.
Joe is an authoritarian fascist, and if we are to believe his story above, some sort of escaped East German Staasi torturer.
None of which is exactly surprising, save that I thought there were some intelligence requirements for such opportunities, on top of the requisite sociopathology.
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Plus, he’s getting poorer by the day.
SRS 5.91 -0.15 (-2.43%)
Jake,
You bore me.
How’s that for ad hominem?
Nice job of adding to his traffic … why do you think he talks about politics anyway? To convert the masses, initiate conversation on a slow market day, feed his ego slapping down the trolls and non-believers or just for shit and giggles, huh?
Treu — why waste the keystroke, Bug?
Don’t go away bored, just go away.
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@ Alvari — Would that I could truly rely on your promises, my under-bridge friend.
Unfortunately, dramatic claims of departure are another solid tenet of the internet troll, and one we’ve heard from you and Purdy many times. Amazingly, you both find yourself a comfy spot under the Verrazano every time.
And let me just “lol” at how much it vexes you that I respond to my commenters. You really are one odd bird.
Continue getting the help you need.
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“dramatic claims of departure are another solid tenet of the internet troll”
Indeed. According to you, congress voted to end of western civilization.
Stocks flat.
Dollar down, stocks up.
You are happy, now?
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Everyone wants to blame corrupted big business. But seems to me that you can’t have corrupted business without big government.
It’s the government that enabled the glass steagle act that allowed for the investment banks like citigroup to sell derrivatives and accelerate bear sterns collapse.
It’s the government that can borrow tons of money to inflate the economy artificially and create 100 trillion dollars of unfunded liabilities in the economy that results in credit and debt in the system which allows companies that are insolvant
It’s the government that can enable free lending practices that make it so easy to createa subprime mortgage bubble to begin with that can only result in foreclosure in the end.
It’s the federal reserve, a coperate enabled business that can artificially lower interest rates to create bubbles until bond holders eventually sell forcing them to raise interest rates which will only take the prices back to where they should be.
Any system that isn’t corrupt, has consumers setting the demand. Advancements cause competition and lower prices which is driven by demand. Look at technology. Every year computers get better and faster, yet they remain just as cheap if not cheaper than before. If you don’t have government restrictions, the companies enabled by the government won’t have a stranglehold on prices. Consumers will simply buy elsewhere. Look at lasic eye surgury where government isn’t involved. If you want power to the people, you have to give power to the consumer, and the consumer can only have power when he/she isn’t forced to pay for government programs that end up funding businesses saleries through taxes and inflation. That way you simply lower prices by boycotting and orginizing groups that refuse to pay. Pretty simple concept… Businesses can’t make money in areas where people aren’t interested, unless of course they’re bailed out and incentivized by governments.
If you give government the power, it has to pay for it by taking it away from someone else. If printing money was the solution, Zimbabway would own the world.
Any time you’d like to guest blog, let me know.
Eggsellent analysis.
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The fact is, the bigger the government, the easier it is for corperations to influence the decisions through bribery, through having former employees run for office and through campaign money and other means.
If you want power to the people, regulation of businesses in the end just makes it easier for a select few businesses to govern the many.
Treu dat … I doubt Dodd would ever propose such a stringent Financial Reform Bill if he was running for re-election and taking the lobbyist $ he use to … it says something about the system when a lame duck has the courage of his convictions (whether you agree with him or not) when free from the restraints of campaigning.
His action makes a good counter argument against the recent Supreme Court decision to allow unlimited corporate donations … then again, if they were all limited in number of terms served I could deal with the corporate bribery a little better to appease Jake’s insatiable need to provide freedom of speech to corporate america as though their voice was human.
What you forget is that without “corporations” able to speak, you and me would not be able to band together against the GIANT corporations that ALREADY control gummint via the lobbying envelope payment system.
Remember, the “Corporation” in the Citizen’s case was a dinky little documentary producer, not Exxon Mobil.
THEY are already deep deep in the system already. Open your eyes.
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More importantly that little documentary producer didn’t ask the Supreme Court to take up the issue … the right side of the court did it on their own accord – were they influenced to make it an issue by those same contributors or by their party itself???
They were influenced by the trampling on the First Amendment that’s been perpetrated by the fascists in Congress over the last 20+ years.
Long live the Consitution, and may you enjoy it’s benefits forever.
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Best Blog on Internet! Some of you guys need to check yo self….WTF?
@Rand…….take a look at brokering online printing. The internets have allowed the printing process to make quantum leaps in production…think Adobe PDF and CSCO….this has revolutionized the game…. the advances in the printing process has been totally digitized. The Gang printers in CA offer turn key cash box to anyone that can sell and create PDF artwork!
peace
Personally I’m more concerned about the Financial Banking Reform law thats up next.
There’s a whole raft o’ sheet to be worried about from this Gang Of Asshats.
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The vitriol on this thread warms my heart. All actual progress, missteps and all, begins with “debate.” Down with the status quo!
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Something I read in the WSJ that seems to contradict what has been claimed here before though…that is, the death of the drug industry:
“If there is a winner in all this, it is the pharmaceutical industry.
Drug makers — which got on board early with reform — stand to shell out nearly $5 billion more than they had originally agreed to. But on balance, the overhaul looks likely to benefit the companies because more people will have insurance to pay for prescription drugs.
It is “probably the industry that came out best,” said Ira Loss, senior health-policy analyst at Washington Analysis, a research firm.
Drug companies will have to contribute $84.8 billion over 10 years to help pay for the health legislation.
But drug makers also won 12 years of protection against generic-like competition for biotech drugs, an increasingly important and lucrative business.
Companies avoided several measures pushed by some Democrats that would have cut revenue, notably proposals allowing the government to negotiate the price of medicines sold through the Medicare Part D drug benefit for the elderly.
The legislation also doesn’t bar pharmaceutical companies from paying generic drug makers to delay the launch of less-expensive copies, which the Obama administration and several Democratic lawmakers had originally wanted.
Under the health legislation, pharmaceutical and biotechnology companies would pay a tax on drug sales in the U.S., beginning next year. Companies would also provide discounts to eliminate half of the “donut hole” gap in Part D drug coverage that forces some seniors to pay a significant portion of the cost.
Yet even that concession might end up benefiting companies, since some seniors have stopped buying medicines in the gap because they can’t afford the costs, analysts say.
The industry’s trade group, the Pharmaceutical Research and Manufacturers of America, has estimated the net impact of an overhaul on the industry’s U.S. revenue would range from a gain of 1% to a loss of 2%.
The industry had spent heavily to promote passage of the legislation. Just last week, Americans for Stable Quality Care, an advocacy group that receives heavy funding from PhRMA, ran supportive television commercials in districts with key Democrats. Dan Mendelson, president of Avalere Health, which has been advising health-care companies about the legislation, said drug makers were already factoring an overhaul into their financial planning. Now, “they can say, ‘This is what we are living in, and now we can plan,’ ” he said.”
But drug makers also won 12 years of protection against generic-like competition for biotech drugs, an increasingly important and lucrative business.
That’s corporate fascism defined. Pay off Congress to erect artificial barriers to competition.
This is why we need to get the money out of Washington, before it brings down the whole show.
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What a morning for banking coin! You had the perfect set-up with DeathPanel nut jobs like Jake quivering in their foxholes which allowed thinking traders to buy squeezable drug and health mgmt stocks and make a killing.
Thanks Jake
Clown parades usually begin with a squeak.
Chuckle. Here we go again:
What’s a Purdy post without a bullshit straw man argument for him to fling his feces at?
Show me where I was “huddling in the foxhole” and shorting this market, Einstein.
Oh, that’s right, you just made it up, again.
Same old Purdy shit, different Purdy day.
Try not to let that long term simmering resentment eat you up too badly, eh?
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Off Topic:
I grabbed a started position in MON around $71 …. just saying
Nice buy point. I think ags will continue here, including ANDE.
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I was looking at MON, too…but at a less ambitious $73. Has fallen just short…(so far).
Bought some GILD for the pharma play.
(Also, just checking in on my positions…absolutely killing it in LVS & WYNN. Vegas, baby, Vegas!)
Was clinton pres when the dot com bubble burst?
Guess democrats are not all they are cracked up to be, huh?
let’s see….
annualized returns during Clinton’s presidency: +14.35%
annualized returns during W’s presidency: -5.81%
annualized returns during Obama’s presidency: +38.38% … boo ya!
Clearly, these “socialist” democrats are bad for the market… how I miss the good ol’ days of Dubya!
Ummm… let’s see Clinton from 92-94?
Then Clinton, post Newt Gingrich Congress (purse strings, Civics 101?)
That’s what I thought.
As for your Master, Barack. Figure your “boo-yah” from the date of his ELECTION.
Ahh, the power of the printing press.
Hold on! 😉
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So Jake, you’re giving Congress credit for the stock market performance during the Clinton administration – what a spin, LOL.
Obama – Date of his election? Or date of his inauguration? Another positive spin for Bush, LOL again!
Well yes, if you consult your high school civics text, you’ll note that the Congress is the one that passes the spending and tax laws.
The President, unless it’s his policies which the Congress advances (as was the case w. Reagan’s tax cuts), really has nothing to do with fiscal policy.
Can you point out the policy pushed by Clinton (save for NAFTA) that made the markets boom in the late nineties? He certainly was not a proponent of cap gains tax cuts. He needed to be prodded mightily toward signing that bill.
He’s certainly got nothing to do w. monetary policy as mentioned above, either.
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Added PAR a few days ago for some tech …. ALEX gets a nice P&F projection to 55 from current $33 (Sugar/RE/Transp)
That’s a blast from the past… Aloha-stock?
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China connection and coffee/sugar not to mention golf courses and CRE in Hawaii:
http://www.alexanderbaldwin.com/businesses/agribusiness
Sugar > Problem there may be this: Private company whose product is distributed by Cargill
http://www.truvia.com/about/default.aspx
Shipping & Transportation > You familiar with the Jones Act?
Aside: MMS s/b a beneficiary of Health Care Bill and a potential takeover though not unrecognized
I knew I liked you.
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I remember back in January when that Republican dude in Mass won Kennedy’s seat that was supposed to be the catalyst to move the markets higher. Markets promptly sold off 8%. Then the healthcare bill passage was supposed to send us straight back to the depths of despair. Yet the market is up slightly today.
Markets did nothing under Bush Sr. and Bush Jr. when compared to the expert economic leadership of Clinton. So far they’re up quite nicely under Mr. Obama as well. Perhaps all this bullshit about Repubs = Good for markets, Dems = Bad for markets should be re-evaluated?
Ironical, no?
Yes this is a complete “kick ’em when they’re down” post and is not intended to be taken seriously.
That’s true Po …. everyone thinks that because the GOP is pro biz that the markets will respond but in reality it has been the Dems that have provided the market stimulus via spending and low interest rates … maybe it’s just a case of rates coming down when the Dems gain control from the bubble bursting GOP economic policies but historically the market has done better under the dems since WWII other than Carter.
I figured Jakie-boy would be crying on his blog for all the world to see. So funny.
If the market can buy on this news, who knows, perhaps the American public will pull the old “switcheroo” and vote Democrat in November after all. Wouldn’t that be crazy?
Speaking of crazy, did anyone see those teabaggers with their little yellow “don’t tread on me” flags. How cute. Not to mention the homophobia and bigotry. These are your peeps, eh, Jake? Quite a sophisticated crowd you run with, very intellectual. You people need to lose the tin foil hats and get on with your life. How’s that for some “ad hominem” action up in heah!
Toolbaguette – check back in novemeber.
@haha — when you have proof of your vile, if all too typical, knee-jerk leftwing accusations, then you get back to me.
In the mean time, every single videotape of the incidents mentioned of course show none of the behavior you describe.
But you know when the left wing nutz are scraping rock bottom when they are retreating back to their pathetic bleats of “racist!” and “bigot!”
It’s all you losers have left. Sad.
Prepare for the desert walk.
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Thanks jake, i knew that that bubble burst during a democratic residency. Republicans like the trickle down theory while democrats go from bottom upwards.
Yeah, either way the middle class loses.
There is no “trickle down theory”– that’ phrase is a Dem talking point from the early eighties constructed by statists who wanted to disparage Reagan’s very historically normal capitalist equation, namely that capital, let loose, created wealth and jobs.
That was anathema to the Keynsian statist left, so they cooked up “trickle down” to make it sound like it was something new.
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That’s cuz the whole basis was tax cuts for the wealthy would release the capital thus trickle down but the trickle dried up as usual as soon as economic cycles repeat … each cycle got shorter for the working class while the wealthy got more tax relief …. law of diminishing return for both the middle class and the government.
That’s a joke. The term “trickle down” was constructed by liberals. Traditional capital formation is the basis for all strong economic cycles. It has nothing to do with “tax relief” unless you believe the “middle class” — however you’ve been taught to define that term — benefits from government spending that takes away from private capital formation.
Hint — it never does. A strong middle class is built by a healthy private sector, not a fat, inefficient government sector.
Government is a necessary payment, but it’s resources need to be carefully rationed, not the other way around.
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Ah, point taken. Always heard that term, but was not sure how to apply it. Thanks
Your starting to drink the Kool-Aid Rand …. better get some sleep
More like he’s coming out of the liberal media induced fugue. Do some research on the provenance of the term. No Republican or even conservative economist ever used it.
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